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After years of lies and propaganda, European officials finally started asking obvious and logical questions about the MH17 tragedy.
The Dutch parliament requests an investigation into the role Ukraine played in the MH17 incident in 2014. The Tweede Kamer, the lower house of Parliament, specifically wants a look into why the airspace above eastern Ukraine wasn’t closed despite there being fighting in the area.
A motion filed by CDA and SP to that extent received the support of all parties that attended a debate on the matter.
According to CDA parliamentarian Chris van Dam, this investigation must be launched as soon as possible.
“Memories are fading, data is being lost”, he said. “It’s about insight for the bereaved, knowing if something could have been prevented, understanding what happened.”
Minister of Foreign Affairs Stef Blok showed reluctance towards an investigation, possibly because it would go counter to the narrative of simply blaming Russia and the Donetsk and Luhansk People’s Republics.
“We don’t see any reason for it legally”, he said in the Kamer. An investigation will not be easy, because it will also need Russian cooperation, he said. “It is also about their airspace.”
He ultimately agreed in making a fact-finding investigation.
In 2015 the Dutch Safety Board ruled that Ukraine should have closed the airspace above the conflict zone in the east of the country.
If the airspace above eastern Ukraine had been closed, the flight from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur would’ve taken a different route and the 298 people on board would’ve been saved. Despite that, no investigation had been launched into why Ukraine had not undertaken any steps.
The parliament further discussed why Ukraine released a eye-witness in the MH17 investigation – Vladimir Tsemach in the framework of the prisoner exchange. The parliament was actually astonished that it turned out Foreign Minister Stef Blok hadn’t spoken to the Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov at all regarding Tsemach. It was assumed that the Dutch government would take this up at the highest level, but in reality, only the Russian ambassador had been called and told that Tsemach needed to be available for questioning.
Blok did not contact Moscow, or speak to his Russian counterpart at the annual UN meeting in New York. He said that “he was waiting for the right moment.” And the meeting would be held in consultation with the Public Prosecution Service and the Joint Investigation Team.
Ahead of the prosoner swap, the Netherlands urged Ukraine to not hand over Vladimir Tsemakh to Russia. Tsemah, a citizen of Ukraine (as well as many others people handed to Russia) and a former member of an air defense unit of self-defense forces of the Donetsk People’s Republic.
Ukrainian special forces kidnapped Tsemakh from the DPR and moved him to Kiev in June. According to initial claims by Ukraine’s State Security Service (SBU), they detained the driver of a towing truck that transported Buk missile involved in the incident with Boeing 777 of Malaysian Airlines (flight MH17) over eastern Ukraine in July 2014. However, later, the SBU was forced to denounce its own claims. Tsemakh’s air defense unit consisted of one vehicle with Zu-23 anti-aircraft gun and was not deployed near the incident site when the tragedy took place.
Months of torturing and pressure by Ukrainian intelligence did not force Tsemakh to participate in the slapstick comedy show called ‘international investigation of the MH17 crash’. In fact, Ukraine obtained no real evidence confirming any Tsemakh links to the MH17 case because if it had, Kiev would never hand over him to Russia.
Therefore, the official mainstream propaganda turned Tsemakh into a ‘witness’ of the MH17 tragedy.
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By this move, the Netherlands admitted that it is not a neutral side and is not interested in an objective investigation of the MH17 tragedy. The Dutch side had a lot of time to question the supposed witness. However, this was not enough and it wanted the person to remain in Ukraine, where Tsemakh would be subjected to constant physical and psychological pressure. READ MORE
Essentially, it is showing how disoriented the Dutch government is in the MH17 investigation at this point, since it’s becoming more and more of a farce. Even the Malaysian government continues asking for evidence that Russia or the Donetsk/Luhansk People’s Republics are to blame for the incident. Almost no effort is being put to propagate the narrative at this point.
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Good. It’s time to end NATO and its propaganda arm, The Atlantic Council. Bellingcat can then die a natural death, or suicide itself, doesn’t matter.
the dippy dutch have already decimated their creditbility regards this incident. it’s BS.
You cheeky nonsense.
The Russians gave you the information 2014 and you only now talk to the Ukis; traitorous bastards.
Well said, Al.
Has our indian friend gone on a hunting trip or is he making a new wigwam for the winter?
A Jew PR fraud company is “handling” all the disinformation and absolute lies the Uki arseholes are putting out to malign Russia, which had nothing to do with MH-17 as even Malaysians now acknowledge. The BUK system that supposedly downed the ill-fated plane was in Uki hands for more than a decade. so the whole thing is a fabrication.
No doubt Ukraine should have diverted the MH17 flight away from the conflict zone, but hindsight is 20-20. Work conducted by the Dutch JIT, Bellingcat and Boris Nemtsov (“Putin. War”) clearly implicates the Russians in the downing of the passenger plane. There is no other possibility. The Russians have lied since the Defense Ministry on July 21, 2013 provided several alternate theories on the downing of MH17 – all debunked. To believe otherwise is to accept other typical conspiracy theories like 911 was an inside job.
Actually Ukraine flight control did intervene and ordered the plane to fly directly into danger. To listen to the Malaysian Prime Minister, owners of the plane, not granted access to the flight date recorders, the whole thing is a political setup to frame Russia.
The fact that Ukraine was a part of the investigation and Malaysia and Russia weren’t are two items that turn the whole thing into a farce. Just two in a long list of irregularities such as ignoring witnesses who saw no missile trail but did mention a fighter jet.
However like so many other propaganda stunts there is never any logical reason given why Russia would do such a thing. Given the resulting bru ha ha it’s obvious Ukraine had very good reason to do it.
Actually Ukraine flight control did intervene and ordered the plane to fly directly into danger.
Ha! You gotta love the Russian disinformation program. What you say is complete garbage. Of course Russia denies they were responsible for shooting down MH17. This would be paramount to admitting there were Russians in Eastern Ukraine. Russia has denied this as well. Russia denies they invaded Eastern Ukraine twice. At first Russia even denied invading Crimea, but Putin decided he could get good ratings at home so in a Russian documenatry he not only admitted invading Crimea, but he also personally oversaw the operation!
Only Russia-bots and far right wing neo-Nazis deny Russia’s complicity in the murder of 300 passengers flying on MH17.
Sorry regurgitating what cnn/ usa state dept say is not good enough.
We remember how the Iraq war in 2003 started, the media and the governments cannot be trusted anymore.
Only a fool would beleive that.
I can thinknfor myslef , you ovbiously cant.
Recent prisoner exchange found Ukraine returning Ukrainian citizens to Russia.
Crimea wound up as Russian territory without anybody being burned alive.
However like so many other propaganda stunts there is never any logical reason given why Russia would do such a thing.
Given the number of Russian speaking Ukrainians who have accepted Russian citizenship and moved to Russian Joe Biden’s son should get a raise.
Ukraine flight control did intervene and ordered the plane to fly directly into danger.
How do you know that Ukrainian “flight control” has done that? Have you studied MH17’s flightplan? How far from the planned route did the plane come down? I’ll tell you: 6.7 kilometers. As you probably know, another airliner, SIA351, was 30 kilometers (2 minutes) behind MH17. Was that also ordered “to fly directly into danger”? Have you heard Singapore Airlines complain about that? And what about Air India’s AI113 that came from the opposite direction? Was that “ordered to fly directly into danger” by Russian air traffic control?
The fact that Ukraine was a part of the investigation and Malaysia and Russia weren’t are two items that turn the whole thing into a farce.
Is it really a “fact” that “Malaysia and Russia were not”? Both countries had representatives that attended for instance the downloading and analysis of the data from the black boxes. Representatives of both countries have been involved from the very beginning. Just check the amendments in the DSB report. Russia is not “part of” the criminal investigation first because it is a suspect and, apart from that, has no links to the MH17. It did not happen in Russia, the plane was not Russian, there were no Russians on board.
Russia is not “part of” the criminal investigation first because it is a suspect
1) According to your people it’s over, Russia has been convicted sentenced and the punishment is applied, not a suspect.
2) How is the Ukraine not a suspect? They had it all. Motive, opportunity and means.
I could go on. Just give me the answer to one simple question.
What reason did Russia have to shoot down MH-17
They’ve already tested the fuck out of the Buk.
No reason [to shoot down MH17], but plenty reasons to help the rebels by supplying a more powerful weapon against attacks from the air.
Ok I will bite, what was the more powerful they wound up with? NATO support. Sanctions. MSM 24/7 Russia did it, yes they did? That’s like a drunken stupor answer. Emphasis on stu
A BUK. https://sputniknews.com/world/20140723191158699-Moscow-Based-Aviation-Authority-to-Take-Part-in-Deciphering-MH17/ “Both the JIT and Russia agree that the aircraft was downed by a Buk missile. …” The remaining dispute is whose BUK.
Well actually they got the SN and it was Ukraine’s but that sort of evidence doesn’t get aired out on your channels. F.uk.us goes with repeating something 500 times and then its a fact, especially if its a lie. Goebbels was all over it, they learned well.
Let me get this straight now. They used the BUK they got to defend themselves against Ukraine aircraft, to shoot down an airliner.
The “evidence” for the “SN” as shown on TV (why?) does not prove anything. Well, what it proves is that the Russians are not cooperating as a normal innocent party would. They were asked for information on serial numbers long long before. Officially, in a request for legal assistance.
Ok we’ll try it your way, what has Russia gained by shooting down the airplane?
Nothing. They lost something. Respect. At least from rationally thinking people who see through their lies.
Good for you. Who burned those people on the Maidan?
Now that is a strange twist!
See I don’t get past that. The initial part of any situation. That Sevastopol is Russia’s only ice free port. Victoria Newland’s picking the new leader after they got rid of the old in a typical color revolution that used pure Nazis to do the dirty work like rape, murder and burning people alive.
So all your twisted logic about MH-17 rings hollow. I won’t quibble about things I did not personally witness, but love logic.
The report that said Malaysia brought war crimes against the Bush administration and then lost 3 civilian aircraft does make sense. How convenient to pin it all on Russia.
I think the people in Crimea would not go back to the Ukraine if you paid them. Uk has become a failed state. We reap what we sow. Nazi ideology is evil and so is anyone who defends it.
Yeah actual physical evidence and that’s all you say. Seems like pretty normal behavior for Nazis.
Ah, after the failed attempt to deflect the discussion, now entering the phase of insults. Sorry, not interested in that childish game.
Wait a minute I kinda missed this first time around. They had no reason to shoot down a civilian airliner? So how did this help anyone?
“They” had no reason to shoot down a civilian airliner. “They” had reasons to shoot down military aircraft. https://tass.com/world/741164 Oops…! Indeed, this did not help anyone. It did help though to make lots of noise to obfuscate the stupidity. That is what happened from day one.
Oh so it was a stupid mistake why didn’t you say so in the first place.
The same excuse your mom gives, it was a stupid mistake.
I thought you knew…
You believe Bellingcat? Enough said, no one will take you seriously now. Lol! Joint Investagation Team was good at investigating Joints!
Bellingcat just outed another assassination sponsored by the Russian government (in Germany – New Evidence Links Russian State to Berlin Assassination via @bellingcat https://www.bellingcat.com/news/uk-and-europe/2019/09/27/new-evidence-links-russian-state-to-berlin-assassination/). That goes along with the assassination attempt of Sergei Skripal.
Thanks.
Fuck that 40 year old virgin higgins, he is a baught and paid.for liar!
One problem with hindsight is 20/20. Ukraine was very very quick to accuse Russia of supplying the separatists a BUK system which was used to shoot down MH17, noting the system has the range and capability to hit targets flying miles above.
Well this means Ukrainian intelligence (oxymoron in these times) must have assessed a reasonable probability the separatists could acquire an advanced air defence system that could pose a danger to commercial air traffic. After all, Ukraine repeatedly accused Russia of direct military aid and giving the separatists the ability to shoot down Ukrainian jets would seem very plausible.
So let us direct commercial aircraft to fly directly over the conflict zone, I suppose to see if the Russians did supply advanced air defence systems and then we can blame on Russia and control the investigation and rule the galaxy…
This shows the decision not to close the air space was reckless endangerment of air passengers and is indefensible.
But that is not all. Just in case the separatists refrain from firing at the plane due to concern over possibility the target is civilian aircraft, let us trail the commercial jet with two Ukrainian Air Force jets to give the appearance of jets flying in military formation, something commercial civilian aircraft do not do.
This shows the decision not to close the air space was reckless endangerment of air passengers and is indefensible.
What it shows is that the Russian Buk which was photographed and geolocated in Eastern Ukraine numerous times was either handed over to poorly trained separatists, or the Russian military made a colossal error when they shot down MH17. Either way, that is not the fault of Ukraine.
So let us suppose your family was on that flight and know that they would have arrived safely if the airspace was closed as is normal practice in conflict zones. But Ukraine did not close the air space and the consequences are your family is dead – many lost their loved ones and do you think they hold Ukraine blameless?
Can you honestly say Ukraine is entirely innocent? If you think Ukraine is blameless, then it must be ok to continue to direct air traffic over the conflict zone in Eastern Ukraine.
Would you board a plane if you knew the flight path would take you over a conflict zone?
HAHAHAHA…yeah and Dick Cheney had a heart…they need to pay you more.
911 was an inside job duh!!! It was a coup !
“July 21, 2013″…. sorry, just saw this typo… 2014. I obviously agree with the rest of your comment.
Like Ukraine, Russia should have rerouted flights from the opposite direction as well. What if the accident had happened with a plane that was heading West, over the same conflict zone, like for instance AI113 (flying there at the same moment), or even flight MH16, earlier that day? In other words, if people want to blame & sue Ukraine for what happened with MH17 due to not closing the airspace, they must blame & sue Russia equally.
The fact of the matter is the Uki morons shot down MH-17 and made up a plethora of disinformation based on Zionist “advice” same as the wonderful advice MBS was given to invade Yemen and also install dud Americunt patriots ROFLMAO..Uki hohols were dumbasses to begin with but the Jews have literally turned them into total shitheads and liars.
Yeah turn to the US for cover up management. There’s a big difference between getting away with something and covering it up. The end result is most of the world wants nothing to do with them and the eventual backlash will be somber but complete. You know the more they try to cover the more bare they get, it ain’t pretty.
The thing that would be the most disturbing is that they did it on purpose. Just like 9/11
Yup, the Duch.. sorry, the Dutch just be going to this step, is an hafl way admttion of something we know, they lied about everything, and even Malaysia was locked out from the investigation witch is and was an farce, and everybody knows this, stupditys at this level may work in the Imperial banana republic of Moronikans but pleeease, spare us, Duchb….. sorry Dutch, and by the way, one thing was the Missiles, but from the imidiate aftermath of the downing we saw images of the front cabine, riddled with 30 mm cannon hole along with the splinters coming from the BUK, witch is to comapre with an shoot gun, spraying shit over an radius to make shure you damage at least something, etc, to the fact the Russian presidental plane looks remarkably similare to the Malaysians one. Agan, inconsitencys of why on earth was the plain not diverted from its original rute, etc, and then the rest becomes an farce.
And I dont hold my breath and expects something new, if anything. The Duch…. sorry, the Dutch lost their credibility, and what little left, is and will be teremined by what comes next. Stupid f…..
peace