On February 1 morning, the so-called Syrian National Army (SNA) launched a large attack from Turkish-occupied areas in northern Aleppo.
The surprise attack targeted the towns of Kharabishah, Tell Rahhal and the Sha’alah RADAR Base. Within a few hours, the three areas were captured by Turkish a few hours.
SNA sources said the Syrian Arab Army (SAA) lost equipment and personnel as a result of the attack. Furthermore, the sources alleged that a position of the Russian Military Police was overrun by Turkish-backed militants.
The militants’ victory, however, didn’t last for long. The SAA backed by units of the Kurdish Afrin Liberation Forces (ALF) launched a counter-attack in the noon, recapturing all lost positions from the SNA.
Sources affiliated with the ALF claimed that four Turkish-backed militants were killed and six others were injured in the counter-attack.
Click to see full-size map. Source: (@Suriyakmaps) on Twitter.
The SAA responded to the attack by shelling SNA positions in the Turkish-occupied city of al-Bab and in the towns of Dana and Wiqah. Russian and Syrian warplanes also flew over al-Bab. However, no airstrikes were reported.
The SNA’s surprise attack is a major violation of the Russian-Turkish de-escalation agreement in northern Aleppo. This violation opens the possibility for the SAA to resume operations in the region, which has been calm since 2017.
bomb that turkish camelfuckers to hell. zero tolerance
Turkey is not about peace in Syria,rather occupation of Syria. Putin playing danger game at the expense of Syria. The SAA casualties is direct response by Russia pleasing Turkey policies.
I understand your point of view but what would you have the Russians do? If they fight Turkey they lose the wider game; luring Turkey from it’s American-NATO orbit into a more friendly Russian stance. Also, if Russia fights the Turks how do you propose for the Russian MOD to reinforce and re-supply her forces inside Syria? Russian aircraft currently fly over Turkey to get to Syria. Russian ships can only use the Bosphorus to get from the Black Sea to Syria if they are not engaged in hostilities against Turkey. It’s easy to be frustrated and verbally lash out at Russia’s arrangement with Turkey but what is a workable and practicle alternative?
“Russian aircraft currently fly over Turkey to get to Syria” I think that majority of flights comes through Iran and Iraq. But even that can be very dangerous if not accompanied by RAF(Russian Air Force) because of NATO traitorous attacks. Also how Joe Doe would want Russia to respond if Turkey calls for (article 5) NATO help on Russian “aggression”? He would be probably very happy! Because he doesn’t give flying fuck for Russian lives.
And as you accurately point out in the case of war with “only” Turkey Russia would be either forced to ask favors from reluctant Iran for massive flyovers of huge number of aircraft to save their contingent from Turks. Or simply to destroy Turkey in massive all out war. Again what Joe Doe and his (and Assads) trigger happy friends prefer.
I bet that Joe Doe and his “friends” would LOVE exactly that! To fight to the last stupid Russian for their beloved Assad. But Russia doesn’t seam to see that way because Assad does not support Russian policy in Syria is because of him a lousy “allay”.
It used to be true that Russian aircraft flew to Syria via the Caspian and through Iraq by way of Iran, but no longer. Iraq, under American pressure declined over flight permission for most Russian military traffic some 18 months ago. One of the provisions of the Russo-Turkish agreement was an overflight permission.
I didn’t know that!?! I obviously hugely overestimated Iraqi (ZERO sovereignty). Which makes argument for “small” wars against Turkey even less plausible. So only way for Russia to save Russian Syria contingent would be destroying Turkey and starting WW3…
But hay! Who gives fuck as long as Assad is happy ! Russian’s should start one or two World Wars to make Syria right, just the way Assad and his cheer leaders here on SF prefer !
I think it’s more about the cheerleaders here and less about Bashar al-Assad personally. He seems genuinely grateful for the Russian assistance and why wouldn’t he be? From where the Syrian state was in 2015, on the ropes, to the commanding position it enjoys today has no doubt been a major relief to Damascus. And anyway, the Syrian war effort is only marginally about and directed by the office of the President of Syria. Syria’s tribal leaders control the government and they insisted that Assad stay on as President, and insist now that Syria battle the insurgency until victory. Bashar al-Assad could retire tomorrow and Syria’s policies would remain largely unchanged.
It is not secret for very long time that Russia and China have stated in public that “peaceful solution” = compromise must be found for Syria. China and Russia would be able to rebuild the Syria and many others would jump in. Even Iran with their participation in Sochi and Astana conferences have confirmed that they see possibility of agreement with Turkey in exchange for some kind of workable compromise for peace in Syria. I never had impression that Assad really wanted to talk to Turkey in any shape or form. If he did I am sure that Russians would find the way how to convince Turkey to accept that meeting. Turkey desperately needs Chinese investments and peace in Syria for propping up her stumbling economy! Syria was big source of income and gate to Arab world for Turkey. Why would they prefer this war to continue forever?! For tiny patch of land? Assad doesn’t want Kurd autonomy and that is what brings Assad and Erdogan together! They can start from there ! It is very bad for business in Turkey with all surrounding countries either in war or under sanctions ! So I think that motivation for peace in Syria for Turkey can be GENUINE.
I personally couldn’t care less if Syrians want or don’t want Assad … All that is important now is PEACE and getting back to normal life as soon as possible. And my personal impression is that Assad doesn’t want that. He wants to win against everybody ! But is he really capable doing that?! I doubt ! Only by pestering Russia for doing more, maybe?
As I said, it really is only marginally a decision for President Assad to make. A conclave of Syrian leadership actually decides on most major issues, most especially the course of the war. And not caring if Syrians do or do not want Assad as President is how we got into this mess. Too many outsiders trying to impress their choices on Syria and not caring about what the actual majority of the Syrian people want. Many Syrians who want reform will no doubt vote for Bashar al-Assad in the next election because of this interference and not on the merits of his leadership.
Ah, whatever. The way I see it the story always turns around some obscure games within Syria inner power circle and Assad… If they think they can win against everybody good luck to them! They play all or nothing so it is their choice. But they should not complain if some countries lose enthusiasm to support their irresponsible and not realistic adventures. Since they might not be up to the task. And whole region is unstable already and all can turn into even bigger conflicts. In that case they can only say good buy Syria!
They didn’t decide that. Outside forces hijacked the protest movement and shipped in tens of thousands of foreign jihadi fighters and weapons. Syria isn’t attacking anyone outside her own borders and Syria has coordinated all her military offensives aimed at regaining her own damn territory with the Russian command in Syria.
Leave alone past. We all know that and unfortunately we can’t change that ! Today is situation completely different after so many years of war. And Assad for his legitimacy would have to pass new elections.
“Syria has coordinated all her military offensives ” What they didn’t coordinate at all is how to get out of this endless war. They want victory? So they better hurry up if they don’t want this war to last 20 years.
Not sure it’s completely up to them. Outside forces continue to prop up their own proxies in this fight so Syria’s choice is to fight on or surrender. Syrian representatives in Geneva trying to hammer out a new constitution have met with American interference in the form of an opposition trying to swing for the fence and win everything at the negotiating table that they couldn’t win with gunfire. It’s not like the Syrian state is left with a lot of choices. And President Assad doesn’t need your legitimacy, he is the head of the Syrian government and absent any constitutional change will remain so. The electorate in Syria is now more pro-government than before. Tens of thousands of the most anti-government types are dead and millions of others have fled the country. Those that remain are likely to be government supporters and even those who want reform are likely to reject reform imposed at the butt of a gun, or any changes pushed for by jihadi street gangs and their camp followers. How can Syria, or any of us leave the past alone? It surely doesn’t leave us alone because where we are today is the place the past brought us to.
“And President Assad doesn’t need your legitimacy,” Again labeling me and misinterpreting (and taking high moral ground posture) You have talent for melodramatics (very feminine feature). He needs that kind of legitimacy (after the war) for himself to be credible president. Today in war conditions nobody normal would question his legitimacy as President!
“The electorate in Syria is now more pro-government than before.” Good for him so I am sure that he is looking forward for future elections!
“millions of others have fled the country” They also should have possibility to vote (unless war criminals). Hutu have committed horrible genocide against Tutsi in Rwanda and they are back to peaceful life now! What other option is there? To continue the war till they exterminate the last terrorist? But once peace comes war criminals, terrorists will run away from Syria !
“How can Syria, or any of us leave the past alone?” You obviously have an answer! So what do you suggest than?
Well, the Hundred Years War lasted more than 130 years yet the French kept fighting until France was free of English armies and English lords. The Crusader kingdoms were fought against by Muslims, including in areas inside modern day Syria, for two centuries but are no more. Ireland? Vietnam? India? Mexico? Sometimes it takes a titanic struggle to regain your lands and make safe your people but it rarely fails to be worth it. Syria is no different. I reject wholly your argument for surrender and accuse you of being a NATO information war propagandist. Judging by the fact that the Syrian Army continues to march forward and liberate more towns I doubt they’re much impressed by reasoning such as yours. It’s a strategy worthy of intellectual midgetry, and one lacking a spine as well. I should mention also that it has no balls. Other than that it’s a way better argument.
“Hundred Years War” had 10 dead at the most per battle(do I exaggerate number?)
Only because I find absurd that any country ends up in decades long wars if there is really any alternative for peace?! You accuse me of being “NATO information war propagandist” with your “100 year war” argument? And you are probably from NATO COUNTRY somewhere on the West or some “Western” country allied to U.S. aren’t you? While I belong to the nation who was bombarded by NATO. And you pretend to be thousand times more anti-NATO than I am, huh? And accusing me to be “NATO propagandist”?! Well you sound totally retarded. I do not know what else to tell you. Good bye and think whatever you want.
It’s a distant but relevant example. I could use Vietnam, or Mexico or Portugal’s ultimate defeat in Africa. The point is that you can’t win if you don’t fight. It’s defeatist to surrender at the bargaining table and cynical to insist that Syria make peace on her enemy’s terms. Why not come on here and vehemently insist that the rebellion lay down their arms and that the foreign fighters be detained for the sake of peace? No, in your mind the Syrian government has to fall on it’s sword and give in. That’s an American neocon talking point in support of their proxy forces in Syria. And here you are at SF, spouting it off without letting up, putting you in lockstep with the American point of view, wherever you’re from.
It is YOU who all the time present negotiations for peace as “surrender”! Because you have s**t for brains and because you are totally incapable to make single valid argument to prove your point! You are all the time in high moral ground posturing and exaggerating . It is absolutely sickening to listen to you! If you were at least Syrian to have some excuse for your emotions and over reacting! It is boring conversation talking to person like you! You remind me of communists (under whom I have lived). Not much brain, plenty of theatrics and moral high ground and very long speech, MONOLOGUE without any possibility to communicate!
All your so called “arguments” are distortions and manipulations of my words and misinterpretation of the meaning of the words in general! Or even worse, slandering me and accusing me because you have put words in my mouth I have never said! I don’t give flying fuck to convince you into anything any more! You are just another simpleton, member of CHEERING club here!
As proverb would say: Group of people who share the same “opinion” have no opinion at all !
GOOD BYE!
Fuck you, piece of shit. Syria can’t make peace with jihadi street gangs in Syria you dumbass and you know how I know? Because the jihadi groups have violated every ceasefire in Idlib that’s been negotiated. They refused to remove their heavy weapons, they continued to shell Aleppo and they continued to send drone attacks toward the Russian airbase. How could Syria make any kind of trustworthy peace with people who fail to respect ceasefires? You are a certifiable idiot.
And WHO asks ” jihadi street gangs ” anything you fucking retard ?!!!!?? It is agreement between Russia , Turkey , Iran and Syria ONLY!!!!!!!!
Who gives fuck about terrorist from HTS what they want or what they think?!? Turks? Turks prefer TURK INTERESTS ONLY ! Who gives fuck about HTS “heavy weapons” that can all be destroyed in few days if Turkey STOPS supporting them and pulls back together with all their militias!!
What the fuck is wrong with your logic?!!! Why do you make Turkey = HTS ?! Turks support HTS as INSTRUMENT only to impose their interests ! HTS are not loyal to Turkey and they are not important for Turkey ! So Turkey would SELL THEM OUT immediately for the right price!
Go out to Syria and roll up and begin lecturing Syrian soldiers about making peace with the noble enemy. Get your ass strung up.
Once Turks pull back their militias back and close border for HTS they will be FINISHED very quickly by SAA and Russians ! But Assad must make agreement against Kurds that would be very popular in Erdogan’s and Turk eyes! So that Erdogan has something to show to his voters in Turkey !
Turkey hasn’t enforced any agreement on HTS or even it’s own proxies inside Syria. The Turks have a different plan. Your surrender maneuver would help them greatly with that plan. But go, get a flight to Beirut and spread the good Z.P. word to the Syrian Arab Army. You’ve got the superior strategy tell them. Time to negotiate with jihadi gangs and Turkish proxies for peace. See what happens to you.
HTS was just joined by Turkish proxy forces outside Aleppo yesterday, releasing a statement about a unified command. So HTS does equal Turkey, at least at this point.
As long as Turkey let them pretend to be boss in Idlb they can make those STUPID declarations !
If Turkey pulls back their militias HTS can wipe their arse with that worthless “declaration”!
No you don’t understand a thing ! Turkey just uses HTS for their objectives and lets them control Idlib because they are militarily much more capable than Turk militias and with higher combat moral !! So they need them now in this situation. But HTS needs Turkey so they don’t create problems to Turk stooges (and they despise them) So it is LOGICAL for Turkey to support them as long as they need them in Idlib !! But if the PRICE is right (offered by Assad ) that he will SELL them immediately and turn his back on them DESPITE PRESSURE from US and NATO !!!
If Turkey that and if Turkey this. Russia had an agreement multiple times with Turkey that included a jihadi and proxy pullback 20km from the contact line. It didn’t happen. The M5 highway was to be opened up for safe Hama-Aleppo vehicle traffic. It didn’t happen. Shelling was to stop of Syrian urban areas, it didn’t happen. Drone attacks on Russian forces were to stop, it didn’t happen. Only an idiot would insist that Syria make any kind of deal with these people, at lease right now. They are not agreement capable.
If the price is right. Ah, your creeping stealth surrender. What would Syria’s government have to surrender to Turkey as a part of this price being right? How much territory would be enough for you? What kind of concessions are the Syrians to make to one of the co-conspirators who invaded their country? You argue in broadstrokes for this crap but never provide details on your surrender in Syria plan.
WHAT territory moron?! It was AGREED in Astana that Syria must be PRESERVED in the same borders !!!! Turkey has ACCEPTED that in AGREEMENT ! Are you too dumb to process simple information like that?! Erdogan has repeated that information himself that Syria must be preserved with the same borders ! He is AGAINST Kurd autonomy let alone independence! I do not fucking provide “details” only because I am not God to know what kind of arrangement they can come up with !!
Personally I am for SAA as ONLY Army in Syria without autonomous regions (for Kurds or Sunni or anybody else) I am for Assad as transition President and for organizing new elections under his supervision only ( with international presence ) For amnesty of all fighters that did not commit war crime against SAA , Syrian police and Syrian population! Terrorist and war criminals must be punished !! And Syria is one and indivisible with the same frontier including occupied Golan of course. Everything else could be negotiable.
You are for negotiations that drag on forever. You argue for Syria’s surrender over and over by putting the burden on them to stop fighting and surrender the bulk of Idlib province and the areas that Turkey controls farther North. Turkey has accepted a lot of things in agreement but then not lived up to their agreements. President Assad will not agree to transition anything-it’s not up to militants or outsiders to decide. There will not be a UN operated jackbooted truth and war crimes commission roaming around Syria arresting Syrian police officers and soldiers. Any agreement that you write about that included those provisions is dead on arrival. Unless you are arguing for a Syrian surrender. That’s what I hear.
Good riddance. You are the one who continued this exchange this morning, not I. But you are not going to convince me with your case that Syria should bear the burden of peace by surrendering to America’s proxy jihadi groups. And most people come to SF to check on and root for Syria’s liberation from this Imperial regime change operation. We, especially me, hardly appreciate your endless insistence on Syria ending this conflict on jihadi terms. Go away…
Look up the battles of Crecy, Poiters, and Agincourt. There were thousands of casualties, mostly French. Mont St. Michel was under English siege for decades. If you read more history you might understand better why people don’t prefer to surrender their country or their futures to invaders. The SAA and it’s government are continuing the offensive today and have liberated new towns. Clearly your better argument for surrender is lost on them.
You are EXAGGERATING all the time ! Assad is winner in Idlib !!! He is not in position to negotiate ” surrender ” but to negotiate his victory! His way to get his country BACK COMPLETELY ! If he gets Turks on his side Kurd’s are roasted ! Even if Americans stay and defend them they will not be able to fight back against SAA and allays and Turks on top all of that !
If that is your opinion than you are an uninformed dumbass. The Syrian government agreed to the constitutional committee. It has been sidetracked by the Americans and their proxies who argue that Syria should surrender and allow the opposition into the government. It’s not going to happen and why should it? The opposition includes people who gunned down police officers and became traitors and stooges for outside foreign powers. Who is the Syrian government supposed to parlay with? The militants won’t comply with ceasefires and the opposition representatives are asking for the moon. Syria has no choice but to fight on and Syria, Russia, and Iran all see it that way. You don’t, and are therefore both out of step for SF and with the people you pretend to be friends with.
There we GO AGAIN !! Fuck Americans! Fuck NATO desires and objectives ! The ” opposition can include” ONLY the people who never participated in the war ! Who never killed anybody ! “Who is the Syrian government supposed to parlay with?” How the fuck should I know?! There must be few highly educated people who escaped on the West or in Turkey and whom Turks see as good representatives of Idlib Sunni’s.
The militants WILL COMPLY if Turkey say so !!! Those “opposition” assholes depend LOT on Turkey and huge number of Syrian refugees lives in Turkey ! Without Turk support they represent almost nothing! Opposition representatives will be asking what Turkey tells them to “ask”
Fuck them this and that you say. But here you are making the case that it’s Syria’s burden to make peace with the people who invaded their country, provided weapons and material support to the insurgency and who have failed to live up to any agreement they’ve made so far. Turkey said that the militants would withdraw 20 km from the contact line in Idlib. They didn’t. Turkey committed to opening the M5 highway. They didn’t. Turkey committed to enforcing a cease fire and they have not. Your stupid surrender argument flies in the face of proven reality.
Turkey is enemy ! And they cheat, but they also can be bought ! Astana was just step in right direction in which Assad doesn’t want to go. So Turkey is still enemy…but they also can be bought ! Turkey is important regional power and important NATO member only available to negotiate also! Nobody else on the West-NATO wants really to negotiate but Turkey! And Turkey is the most influential country in Syria!!! It is not Russia or Iran but Turkey since they are accepted in the eyes of many Sunni as their representative !! So they are perfect as “enemy”to make peace with and put the pressure on Syrian Sunni to implement the agreement!
You refuse to answer for Turkey’s failure to live up to her agreements so far while arguing for the Syrian government to make larger and wider agreements with them. You are like some stupid ostrich with it’s head in the sand. The Astana agreement stated that the M5 highway would be opened, is it? The shelling of government areas was to stop, did it? The Turkish proxies and HTS were to withdraw 20km, I’ll clue you in, they didn’t. Turkey was to have 12 observation points but just unilaterally opened two more. Your argument to deal with them just sounds stupid, in the adult world. When the previous agreements are honored you might have a leg to stand on but the glass really is half empty right now.
That’s President Assad to you, piss ant. And the reason that Syria wants no part of further talks with Turkey is because Turkey is not agreement capable, at least at this point in the conflict. Hundreds of thousands of people in Northern Syria are ethnic Turks and want to be brought home to Turkey like Northern Cyprus was in 1974. Turkey has it’s own goals here and those goals are served by looking like they are being reasonable by making deals with Russia that they can’t honor because of the different objectives they have and because they don’t want to lose personnel taking on HTS to live up to those agreements. I respect Turkey’s position but I’m not stupid enough to think Syria’s interests are actually served by making agreements with Ankara or trusting them not to do what they need in pursuit of Turkey’s own goals in Syria.
That’s President Assad to you you disrespectful little regime change loving punk. President Assad and the Syrian government has concluded the opposite of your “wise(ass” counsel. They have witnessed the very people you want them to ally with break cease fire after cease fire, shelling and killing little girls in their beds inside Aleppo city. They know that the opposition negotiators in Geneva are having their strings pulled by the U.S. State Department, who is trying to use the process in an effort to snatch victory from the jaws of defeat inside Syria. And here you are on SF, starting flame wars with a tiresome and stupid argument that Syria could and should end the war by giving in to the demands of the opposition and the murderous jihadi street gangs. You’ve stated your Ameripunk jihadi loving position ad nauseum here and have failed to convince anyone. Because the Syrian government has no real path to a negotiated peace because the insurgency is not agreement capable.
You fail to respond to the basic factual point that Turkey has failed to live up to any agreement inside Syria. The jihadi street gangs did not pull back 20km from the contact line and Turkish forces didn’t even try to make them. The M5 highway wasn’t opened to traffic, or did I miss that in a newsfeed somewhere? Maybe the Z.P. gazette? Or, Z.P. daily news because that would be the only reality where it happened. Did the shelling on Aleppo stop? If it did why are Russian fighters bombing insurgent positions in Idlib today, as we type? Because none of the agreements Turkey took responsibility for was honored and your argument for more agreements with a side who has their own reasons for not being agreement capable is nothing short of stupid. Answer the questions about Turkey’s agreement violations before diatribing on endlessly about the value of surrender.
“ And not caring if Syrians do or do not want” I think you completely distort meaning of my words. I have said opposite! I have said and I will repeat it again that : I do not care if Syrians will support or not support Assad in next elections it is only up to them to decide! And I cannot see what you or anybody else could possibly have against their choice?! It is their inalienable right to chose
Actually I have no idea what you are trying to say. It seems you are a Bashar al-Assad hater, probably because of your exposure to MSM. If some powerful foreign force invades your country you fight back or go down in history as a traitor to your people. He sure as hell isn’t that.
I say that I do not believe in mantra that this war can not have peaceful solution. And I say that Assad for his own reasons seeks full and unconditional victory not wanting compromise with anybody.
You are just a contrarian who likes to argue for the sake of argument. I’m not an especially patriotic American but I’d fight to defend my country if it were to be invaded, no matter how long it would take or how imperfect I find our society. By your logic Stalin and his Kremlinites should have made peace with Hitler at the gates of Stalingrad because fighting on toward total victory would have just been too hard and taken too long. But thinking that way sells out the memory of all your brothers who fought and died to that point. I sure hope no one has to fight alongside you in any trench somewhere-you’d give up too easily.
You ate full of pathos and posture of patriotic heroism and deliberately misinterpret my words like I was asking something horrible. There are obviously Kurds and some Sunni Syrian population who are not very enthusiastic about Assad. And here on SF that is taboo that nobody ever talks about.
This is not about “peace with Hitler ” but about peace with all Syrian population. Maybe there is modality that some compromise is made without need for more war? Why is that even compared with “peace with Hitler ” They are also Syrian population. They should have equal rights
Thousands of Syrian Army soldiers would disagree. And thousands of Syrians loyal to the government are trapped behind enemy lines, ruled by jihadi street gangs. By your plan they should be written off. So, President Assad or his senior representatives should go out to the soldiers and say “hey guys, this is good enough. We have to give in and settle just for the part of the country we have, it has to be good enough. But look on the bright side, we are only fighting jihadi extremist head chopping militants here, sponsored by American asses. It’s not like we’re fighting Hitler or something. “
Nonsense! Nobody would be “written off” and terrorist and war crimes against anybody would be punished! But after everybody is punished than normal life would have to restart in Syria!
“We have to give in and settle just for the part of the country we have, ” No he doesn’t have to do that of course! He can continue doing the same and we will see the results! As proverb would say; He can talk the talk but can he walk the walk? Time will only tell ! I find him little bit on optimistic side but that is his absolute right as President to chose right direction for the country! I am sure that plenty of them are ready to follow him to walk them even of the cliff if necessary.
Where did I say they “have to give in and settle just for the part of the country “?!? I am talking about peace in whole of the Syria not “part of it” ! But Syria built on some necessary compromise… But President Assad doesn’t want it so war continues and nobody knows even against whom else yet… might be a Kurd’s,Turks; some more ISIS come back or whatever the usual enemies of Syria can com up with…
None of that bullshit made any sense.
War crimes punishment, and a commission to roam around the country and kick in the doors of Syrian police officers and soldiers and drag them in front of truth and reconciliation courts is a critical demand of the opposition negotiators in Geneva. It’s a non starter for the government as the whole process would focus on what the police and government did to maintain and restore order, not the murder of police officers and the treasonous dealing with foreign agents that kicked the whole conflict off to begin with. It’s a Imperial talking point and for you to spout it off here suggests that you have an entirely different agenda that what your pretense suggests.
When was that, few years ago? Take look at the map now and COMPARE with the situations then and now! It is radically different ! Today it is Assad who can dictate major conditions not “opposition”! SAA is winner and nobody will take winning army to the court ! SAA is the official army of Syria and that is one of the points that is not negotiable ! Only terrorist have to go to the court if they want to stay in Syria !
You go back in the past with your TIME MACHINE and call those condition “non starter”! Of course they are “non starter” since they were asked by opposition in those days when they believed that their position was “strong” ! Today their position is very weak so they will lower their conditions accordingly!
You are arguing my position now. Syria is winning as the map shows. Why surrender when you are beating your enemy? Your argument makes no sense and are posting bullshit just to post. Syria is advancing and liberating new towns today. There is Syria’s answer to your bullshit suggestion that they peace up with jihadi street gangs.
Your position is only “position” of retarded PARROT talking the same “drama” crap! They have possibility to have peace with Sunni in Idlib and put Kurds in their place with Turk help! But people with SHIT for BRAINS like yourself can’t ever see further than their nose! And try to combine the advantages! Do your “100 year war” and shut the fuck up because it is horror to listen to you.
GOOD BYE !
Who cares what you think. You are a moron or an American regime change apologist. You seem to know nothing about the status of the negotiations in Geneva or how the opposition has been obstinate in insisting that they win everything at the table that they couldn’t win in warfare. Why would Syria agree to that. You are an American loving punk, just spouting off their information warfare that the Syrian government should make peace with the insurgents and the jihadi street gangs. You make no sense. The Syrian government doesn’t agree. They are advancing today in both Idlib and Aleppo provinces under cover of heavy Russian airstrikes. Forward to victory.
Who cares what you think !!
This is not effing Western backed “Geneva”but ASTANA arrangement with Turks ! Fuck the US “opposition”from “Geneva” ! They are not option for very long time already ! Americans were NOT INVITED in Sochi Russia and NOT INVITED in Astana, Kazakhstan. The American “opposition”was not invited there also!
” You are an American loving punk,”‘ And you are fucking retarded idiot of the worst kind ! I have seen stupid people but you are the champion !
So go to your “victory” retard. We will see how that is going to workout for the rest of the Syria ! Another 10 years maybe? Like give fuck what person who talks about “100 year’s war” (as an option) thinks!
Military history informs us of examples of strategy and lessons from the past. I provided other examples as well. You fail to grasp the basic lessons of all of them; one cannot win without being committed to fight for your cause. The Vietnamese did not surrender after losing the Tet offensive. They fought on at great cost and won their country back. Other examples include the independence of Ireland, India, and Mexico. The defeat of the Crusader kingdoms and the Red Army losing millions of men in a fifty month battle all the way to Berlin. Syria clearly understands this which is why they fight on and are liberating more towns while you try to endlessly educate me about the values of surrender to jihadi street gangs and their puppet master. You are pathetic. Your shit argument is fucking ridiculous. The Z.P. maneuver “surrender to win and bring peace” point of view is just…stupid. You should be running in shame for even suggesting it, yet here you are, flaming on endlessly and doubling down.
Your compromise means surrender as so far no agreement has been adhered to. Maybe if Syria cedes all the territory she doesn’t now control in a peace settlement? Would Syria’s partition be the kind of compromise you are talking about?
Whatever I am tired of this this time Good bye for real…
Oh no. I’ll miss your endless arguments for surrender. Whatever will I do with my time? I’ll head on over to the other stories about ongoing SAA advances in Idlib as the Syrian government spits on your argument and carries on with winning back as much of their own country as they can.
“You are just a contrarian who likes to argue for the sake of argument” Well I have impression that I am taking middle road between pro-Assad and anti Assad which is if nothing else original since nobody else on SF has it.
So everybody here is either unconditionally pro Assad or opposed to him. I am now neither of those two. So call me “contrarian” to everybody if that makes you happy. My argument is that peace has no alternative ! And I think that my argument is better than yours!
Your peace would be a peace imposed under imperial guidelines. And your better argument seems somewhat moot as the Syrian Republic writ large continues to resist and is pushing hard to liberate new areas, daily. And even if you are right about the path forward to peace the Syrian government with or without Bashar al-Assad as it’s President isn’t likely to weaken their position at the bargaining table by standing down the Idlib offensive or signaling an intention to make large concessions needed to reunify the country. That would be just stupid. To find some middle ground the opposition would need to moderate their demands, something so far not in sight.
In life absolutely everything is about choices and timing ! If President Assad chooses the war till total victory he will have to cope with the consequences of that decision. And he will have nobody to blame but himself if he is wrong in his choice. Every choice has good and bad sides so it is always important for good strategists to recognize those as possible advantages in certain situations.
“signaling an intention to make large concessions” If you label something as “large concessions” it is already hardly acceptable. The magic of any compromise is to find ACCEPTABLE “concessions” for all sides. Because peace made “AGAINST” somebody where one side is loser… Peace where “concessions” are not acceptable never lasts long.
“opposition would need to moderate their demands, something so far not in sight” I doubt that very much since Assad is WINNER and his negotiating position is much stronger! The only problem is that his appetite to win is also much stronger so he is motivated even lass than usual to negotiate.
You fail to advance your argument. And you refuse to educate yourself about the realities regarding how Syria’s government makes decisions. As a group the Syrian government has decided against giving in to the American project of changing Syria’s government or governing philosophy by instigating insurgency. It’s not Bashar al-Assad out there on his own deciding this. Your long winded diatribes and quoting my words to pontificate against are both unnecessary for me or anyone else to understand the Z.P point of view: you are for Syria surrendering to Empire for the sake of peace. Got it. Either Syria accepts opposition control of her government, with American handlers or Syria accepts the partition of her country. You are fine with both or either.
I’ll “advance my argument”when you give me concrete, valid, logical counter argument. Your would be “arguments” are about distorting facts or my words or both. —- “giving in to the American project of changing Syria’s government ” Distorting my words again and the FACTS also ! Because you probably have very weak arguments if respecting the facts . Astana agreement was not about “U.S. desires” or Western desires at all ! As you know but refuse to remember, West is kicked out of negotiations on Syria. Only those 3 countries + Syria are to agree about future in Syria. So why do you change the facts all the time?! And WHERE did I surrender to “Empire” , when I talk about those 4 countries only?!? You are boring s*it out of me with your pathos, melodramatic words that have nothing to do with the FACTS ! You sound very feminine. I will not reject yours attempts with false arguments and false facts forever! It is waste of time if you refuse to talk facts! Be honest for once and say why you reject Turkey as alternative to peace and do not waste yours and my time on false arguments please. I suppose Turkey is problem, not Iran or Russia?
And to which ” Empire” is Syria surrendering if negotiating in Astana format? To Otoman Empire maybe? And why do you think that Russia and Iran would accept anything like that ever? Specially now when Assad, SAA has upper hand in Idlib? The only probable total loser will be Kurds and nobody else. So if you really understand “ZP point of view” (which I doubt since you give me false arguments) tell me finally Ricky Miller’s point of view but on the facts please!
Why the hell would Syria as practical military winner have to accept “opposition control of her government” ?!?! Why would they accept to become losers from position of winner?! They have excellent position now for negotiating and Turkey would be happy to get out of difficult situation. So they are in perfect position to impose many things. For some strange not logical reason you see opposite. I just can’t understand your logic at all ! Where do you get those nonsense deductions from?! Assad will have to give them at least something (not even close to what you suggest in yours endless exaggerations!) in exchange for peace.
So again my “long winded diatribes” since you refuse to hear me. Very short; Why is impossible to negotiate with opposition?
Your long winded diatribes fail to take into consideration that the Astana agreements have not been adhered to by the jihadi street gangs or the Republic of Turkey. Is the M5 highway open for safe traffic? Did the shelling of Aleppo and other urban settlements inside government controlled Syria stop? Did the drone attacks on Russia’s airbase cease? Nope. With no relevant party able to live up to their agreements anywhere in sight who would you have the Syrian government negotiate with? The jihadi street gangs themselves? You know those guys massacred captured Syrian government soldiers by the hundreds in multiple locations, right? Even talking to them would be disrespectful to the memory of the SAA’s fallen brothers. It’s not going to happen and you are not going to convince me or anyone else with your American talking point surrender friendly arguments that the offensive inside Idlib should stop. It’s ridiculous.
“Your peace would be a peace imposed under imperial guidelines”
If Russia, Iran, Turkey and Syria are part of the agreement than peace would not be “imposed under imperial guidelines” but as compromise between those interests. Of course for President Assad any negotiation with Turks is not acceptable… So war will continue.
Your facts are in error. It’s President Erdogan in Turkey who hates Bashar al-Assad and refuses to negotiate with the legitimate President of Syria, not the other way around. Assad and the Syrians believe that in the end Turkey will come around and talk, one way or another. They don’t have to surrender control on who their President is to move forward, rebuild from the War, and conduct foreign policy.
If Erdogan hates Assad or Assad hates Erdogan… Who cares which way is it?!?! Many politicians hate each other yet it is their job to talk when they must. If they sit and talk Assad will tell Erdogan his red lines and they will try to reach agreement since both have something to benefit. Why you ALWAYS talk bout Assad peace negotiation as “surrender”?!? If you see that as an “argument” it is idiotic argument since backed by nothing. Why Assad has to “surrender”and why would (even if he wants, and he does not want it) that be acceptable to Russia and Iran that he “surrenders” to Turkey?! It is negotiation in attempt to find formula for peace and not “surrender”!! Can’t you get simple meaning of that word “negotiation”?! Or even that is too difficult?
The Syrians have tried to negotiate with Turkey, through Russia. The Turks have failed to live up to any and all agreements. The jihadi street gangs did not pull back 20km. The M5 highway wasn’t opened up and shelling and drone attacks continued without respect to the ceasefire. Negotiate to what end? Your argument is childish and has the weight of ignorance behind it.
‘The Turks have failed to live up to any and all agreements.’ Yes ! They cheated and they have LOST!! Proof that they can be forced to some things. Proof that Russians know what they are doing Turks tried to cheat…. And they have LOST !! But Astans was just half agreement ! There is NO TRUE AGREEMENT yet between Syria and Turkey. If Syria doesn’t want it they better get ready for more trouble with Turks and without Russian military help in kicking out of Turks….
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I am last to be “exposed” to Western MSM! I hate NATO with all my heart and brain and am pro-Russian to the bone.
I do not understand why is compromise with those Sunni population not possible?
Now of course you will label me to be a Muslim “terrorist”…But I was already labeled to be Jew and what not so I do not care. Terrorist can be dealt with once peace comes back to Syria.
Here on this forum people speak always the same. Nobody tries to question things. My question is why not PEACE? Logical question after this endless war.
Yes, why not peace on NATO’s terms? Another hybrid war “success” for American neocons. They can name it after you, the Z.P maneuver. See you fund and encourage revolt in a country you want to neo-colonise and if that country doesn’t collapse right away and fights back successfully you sanction them to death and insist that the government of said country surrender to the insurgents at the negotiating table in order to have peace. Make sure to turn the President of the target country into a cartoon villain, and invent crazy fictions about chemical weapons and the like. In the end the Neocons get a friendly government and America’s corporations can soon harvest most of the profit margins from yet another productive workforce into their own coffers while leaving the population of said “independent sovereign” state to rake in the marginal values of the leftovers. Ain’t peace grand? The Z.P. maneuver. Manure, more likely.
Russia has no large foot soldiers present to fight Turkey in case of full confrontation. Nato is like gang membership, Turkey can hit & cry foul, you can’t bomb back.
That news look so fake that every sentence contradicts with the other, starting from the SAA & Russians are fighting with Turks, etc, clearly from Kurdish fake news agencies who were betrayed by the US. There is no such thing as SNA was fighting with the SAA in the areas liberated from Kurdish communist party. Any picture with SAA uniform is an amazing & amusing communist guerilla wearing fake SAA uniforms.
At last the truth is out,
“The SAA backed by units of the Kurdish Afrin Liberation Forces (ALF) launched a counter-attack in the noon, recapturing all lost positions from the SNA.”
I’ve had a few arguments with my fellow SF readers concerning the ALF and their loyalty to Assad, read this you cockheads, these are the loyal Kurds that Assad refers to, AND THEY DO COOPERATE MILITARILY, and they have been since January last year.
And the SNA isn’t just attacking SAA held territory, they’re attacking the Russian held territory as well, Nayrabiyah is under attack right now and that’s in Russian occupied/patrolled territory, so rip up that Turkish Russian MoU Putin, it’s worthless now.
ProPalis destroyed the kikes all over the internet so the kikes had to censor in order to propagate their fake news.
The Morale and Morality of Rebels, is as pure as those of Gazans and Afghan Taliban.
Whereas the Morale and Morality of assheadists has already been compromised in the exact same way as the kikes the americunts the turds and kikesis