Coast guard small patrol boat, Project 21850. IMAGE: Ao “Ssz “Vympel”
Sweden’s Volvo Penta has cut off supplies of its engines to the Russian military thus slowing down the renewal of the Navy.
Volvo Penta engines have been used in Chibis coast guard small patrol boats (Project 21850) and Mordoviya and Evgeniy Kocheshkov air-cushioned landing crafts (Project 1232.2).
Volvo Penta engines have been also included in the Yastreb small high-speed patrol boat (Project 12260) export project.
In 2014, German’s MTU already suspended supplies of its MTU 16V4000M90 engines, which had been used in Project 21630 (Buyan-M) corvettes. The move was caused by anti-Russian sanctions imposed by the US and its allies. As a result of this situation, the MTU engines were put only on five ships handed over to the Russian Navy in 2014-2015. Then, the rest of ships were equipped with China-made CHD622V20 20-cylinder diesels instead of MTU 16V4000M90 engines.
This happens when you stop developing your engines and stop their production
Well said. You have engineers, you have reverse engineering. No brainer.
The Swedes can’t stop eating the kabob.
OK, lets go through a very small part of reverse engineering an engine. First up, what’s the crankshaft made from? If you say iron or steel, you will go to the back of the class. It’s an iron alloy, with tiny amounts of other metals in the mix, to give it the qualities you want, such as hardness flexibility/rigidity, can it be cast and machined easily to a high quality finish.
The devil is in the detail, companies do not spend millions of dollars on research if you can knock one up in the kitchen.
Its not like Russia doesn’t have engine manufacturers… its may simply be that they don’t currently build engines in that power/weight category, or if they do, they are not marinised. Its expensive and time-consuming to design a new engine, prototype it, test it, then put into production, especially if their is limited demand.
Having said that, Swedens loss is someones else gain. If they don’t buy from Chinese or Russian domestic producer, they will develop their own.
Russian tanks has state of the art engines…. . So blaming Russia to be unable produce high/end diesel engines is a bit funny. :p
“can it be cast and machined easily to a high quality finish.”
Since we are discussing details, cranks are forged, not cast.
Actually both techniques are used. Forged more expensive and generally stronger for hi performance applications. The cranks in most passengers cars are cast.
True but in diesels I’ve only seen forged.
Now we are quibbling, diesels need stronger cranks with higher compression ratios, so sure. Are all Pentas diesel? Your turn to quibble.
No on the “all Penta diesel” question. The ones I know of that are gas are for pleasure craft and based on automotive engines so I would consider them out of scope for military craft use.
I am past bored with this conversation. Your original comment was an entirely generalized statement, as if there was no such thing as a cast crank. Now you come out quibbling.
If you want to argue about the new 500 hp gas Volvo Penta engine being inappropriate for military use I just can’t get excited about that. After running a quick set of numbers through my head I could get excited about actually building one, but a quibbling argument, nah!
So you were right my comment was ridiculously out of line, absurd really, I apologize for daring to impugn your obviously superior intellect. You win!
frankly knows.
Jack of all trades, master of a few. Car Mechanic, Turbine engine tech and now Electrician. Carpenter, some masonry, painter. Went to engineering school but women too distracting, all my friends were musicians and psychologists. Should have been a poet. Love gardening.
Hopelessly still in love with my ex-wife. Nope wrong word, helplessly, hope springs eternal. With the kids grown up we have rediscovered each other. It’s quite exciting, but also kinda scary. Oh did I mention investment counselor and Sonar technician submarines. Yeah I know haven’t made a new resume in decades and won’t. Brings back too many memories.
Actually worked at Volvo dealers and found this a rather discouraging bit of news as the Penta guys build really good stuff. But you know that saying if it doesn’t kill you it will make you stronger. As much as Russia has endured since the 90’s I would try to be partners rather than dominate them. Look at the Israelis and the Palestinians. Human beings do not want to be dominated, any of them.
Well said!
I worked at a Volvo dealer, mostly pre delivering Volvo240D’s. They also sold Ferrari and Porsche.
80’s yup, switched to turbines around 86′. Worked on a Ferrari before internet translation stuff was around in about 82′. Took a month to get parts, 130 mph in 3rd gear, had two more gears and lots of rpm, scared the shit out of myself on that test drive, dumb kid. Fixed it, 246 dino, red, of course! Trucks looked like they were going backwards.
Had Volvo twin cam V-6s that they put in Maseratis and the Bricklins around, troublesome rigs. Polish craftsman worked next to me used to cut holes in the firewall to remove cams rather than pull the heads, man that guy was an artist, he mumbled under his breath all day in English,” goddamn bullshit” over and over, while smoking his pipe. Most guys change parts, he was a mechanic!
Proud Sweden has become a US lapdog. Sad.
They have been on that trajectory ever since the CIA assassinated Olaf Palme.
When GW Bush appointed Karl Rove Prefect of Sweden they officially became an American vassal.
Karl Rove is a cunt. He is next on my list now that McCain is dead.
yes, everybody is lapdog, except carol daidek-waller, the mossad agent
Quiet you, we dont like fake activists that are really globalists stooges.
It makes no sense to buy western original from Sweden when you can buy 1:1 “original” copy from China from the fraction of the price in dedolarized currency an the same “global” quality.
I supposed, make it in china slap a volvo sticker om, increase pr8ce by 20% lol
Absolutely! Stupid cuck Sweden flooded with headchoppers and rapefugees at Fukus instigation. Im ashamed of myself for once thinking it was a leading nation! I suppose “Misery loves company “which is why Fukus made Sweden a trash – dump as well.
Time for RF to stop buying anything industrial from the EVIL US and the EU slaves.
They’ve managed to produce other goods and foods that were discontinued, due to sanctions. They will do it again. Russia is becoming a powerhouse due to these stupid sanctions – enabling them to become the largest wheat exporter, among many other things.
They are on the cusp of putting their domestic MGTs (marine gas turbines) into serial production, thereby denying the Ukropistanis any chance of future sales, and apart from Russia, who else is going to buy Ukro turbines? Europe? Nope. Us? Nope. Maybe India but only to put them in Russian-build frigates…
Yeah, I was thinking India, some nations in Africa, and perhaps smaller European countries.
There is pipeline gear, power generation as well as marine uses for turbines.
Ukraine isn’t a reliable partner in producing gear for any of these markets. Russia is and can make a killing exporting high-quality turbines and diesels.
This will just be a kill off of more Swedish exports. Seems stupid, as Russia will either start to manufacture their own or get them from Chinese or other sources. More jobs will be lost in Sweden.
The Swedes are just obeying their American masters.
The Swedes have become nothing but a nation of servile cock-holsters, busy in corrupting their own national identity and undermining their social fabric. Expect nothing from these servile money-men.
The Swedes are just obeying their racist supremacist Jewish slave masters.
sweden does not need a little russian market
Swedish population: 10 million
Russian population: 145 million
Ummmm….riiight….
swedish market (buy strength of population) 3000 billion usd, russian market 100 million usd
Put down the crack pipe…
What 100 million are you talking about?
the abilty of ruskies to buy quality goods.
Quiet you neo trotskyte
Sweden’s biggest export is cameltoe’s. We get a lot of Swedish and Dutch tourists here, and the girls wear the tightest shorts on the planet.
Good god, I envy you! Admit it, it’s much better than the American moose knuckles.
..and the Hippo arses.
Yum!!
Sweden has lost all vestiges of dignity. First with the false “rape” charge on Julian Assange to please the United States. Sweden has no sovereignty just a vassal of US/Nato/Israel. Shameful.
Back when GW Bush was President, the US took over Sweden. Sweden is just another American colony.
The Swedes will pay a price for their unabashed servility to the Clown Empire. They are already undergoing social corruption and decline due to their absurd open-door policy and accepting the worlds trash onto their streets. Karma will act to balance the account whether you wish it or not.
Sweden won’t exist in 20 years along with a lot of other conquered slave states of the racist supremacist global jewish confederate slave empire dictatorship.
Everyone knows the Swedish men are servile drunkards who are easily led. That is why Swedish women are forced to go looking for” love affairs” with rapefugees! Disgusting!!
That is when i started being ashamed of once liking them. I am a Progressive and yet hate their ultra -leftie Soros-inspired gov. Controlled opposition of Fukus!
“Ultra-leftie Soros-inspired” is an oxymoron. There is nothing leftist in billionaire trying to increase his wealth, quite the opposite. Masking activities as being leftist is just standard “wolf in sheep’s clothing” thing.
In order for ultra-leftist and Soros to fit in the same sentence you need to add “seizing all his assets” and “putting him in jail” to it. :)
Agree 100%. The intention of Soros is to neuter governments and force them to cede control of their nations to a central polity controlled (behind closed doors) by Elite money. The mega-rich become the New Aristocrats and use the 4th-Reich power structures to enforce their rule. Democracy fails as the voters have no-one to vote for who can/will challenge the system. Media acts as the Establishment gate-keeper to enforce the official narratives, conceal the truth, and act as attack dogs to bring down any “mavericks” in national politics who dare to challenge the NWO.
Well said!
I agree with you whole -heartedly. I should have chosen my words more carefully. I consider Soros a zionist misanthrope who is the closest thing to a James Bond Evil genius the world has!
I wrote ultra Leftie because as you say his sheepskin has fooled predominantly ultra Lefties. It is they who have taken on and stupidly believed in his policies the most. Having said that I consider myself a Progressive so that is saying something!
Yes, and its rather amusing seeing Soros’ “useful idiots” and “useless eaters” running about wildly as storm-troopers for a corrupt nefarious movement that they would HATE to the core if only they had the sense to see it for what it truly is!!! Its one of the delicious ironies of life, or it would be if Soros and his Masters were not such sinister threats to us all.
Russia worked around it. Problem solved, it looks to me.
Who is the problem, Sweden? No, Russia is the problem. If you can’t develop a bunch of small ship engines (that 10 million Sweden can develop), and even have to buy chinese engines instead, then you are the problem.
Why is it that China can make them and you can’t?
Btw what happens when Sweden stops the repair parts? Those ships will have to stay in port? Why is your military reliant on western manufacturers? Are you retarded?
simple,cost the Swedish engines cost less then the Russian ones,Russia is more the capeble of manufacturing its own engines but its expensive to develope them and make the tooling for them thats why they use chinese engines instead these engines are used in small ships witch are expendeble all of the large ships and all subs (both nuclear and desil electric) use Russian propultion systems.
Exactly, these people who say just make it yourself have no idea of the financial and intellectual cost of engineering. The idea that everyone should be an expert in every field is like telling the brain surgeon to fix his own car.
Yeah your argument is pretty weak. If a chinese engine is cheaper why not. No point wasting time and ressources reinventing the wheel here. Buy cheap china, save a couple bucks, maybe have leftover money for an extra ship, i dont see a problem here. Just volvo loosing business for something stupid.
We saw where that got the US with China – 500 billion trade deficit and China becoming a bigger economy than the US.
Now US elite is growing crazy to stop it, but it could be too late.
Deindustrialisation is never a good idea.
Your correct about deindustrialisation. I dont know what the industrial state of russia. I do know that volvo makes good engines and good machines. A personnal favorite of mine is volvo L120. Turbo sounded so good, really powerful and smooth operation.
Maybe the russians wanted a really good engine, pay a bit more if it meets requirements. Or they might even have been onnsale .
The US have long past the rubicon with respect to China.
US neoliberal capitalists have sold the US down the river, and the corrupt Ruling Elite have only now realised it…
Yeah, I remember an interview with Brzezinski that said it was too late to do anything about China. His worry was a Sino-Russian alliance which the US must stop at all costs. LOL
Brzezinski and McCain are sharing a steaming cauldron of boiling excrement in Hell. Even the Devil needs to economise sometimes.
There is one more seat available, reserved for Lindsay Graham. The Devil is patient, and is happy to wait….
South more like Peter Sellers and Charlie Chapling to me.
Do many things to China is many different things.I think he talks about domination.
I am fine the Chinese has raised the living standards and they now are productive partners to the rest of the world. I am no Brzezinski but regulations also are fair trade in a peacefull way all over the world. Here USA here ande there could behave better themselves (too).
No, they have not. Parts of the world market shold be controlled better and reformed some.
Parts of the shorttimes taking money in should be strictly forbidden and have delays in staead.
They do have lacks. In my oppinion its about more and better education fot their low and middle class parts, which should fullfill better, they dont have to outsouce and by that keep jobs and income in USA some more. They are against that part – like fx Obama care in a wider version.
I so, we all have. I dont think we have. But I do think, we should change and outbalance China as well as others in the world market during time.
Russia has never been de-industrialised so not really a good example. Russians have remained content to buy foreign equipment if the price is right, quality is good, and if domestic equivalents are inferior or just not available. Put them under sanctions pressure and instead of appeasing the aggressor they will put in the efforts for import-substitution.
USA is not trying to stop China. They by good reasons all in the world see manipulate prices for its Yuan as well at limit ownership in China – But China can buy almost anthing in west they want.
Good reasons for USA ignored by You even I dont like any Trumpet solutions.
Be a chinese malfucntioning machine Yourself.
Lol your not drunk enough…talking nonsense again!!!
Ive never ran a chinese machine yet, ive ran Doosan (korea) not that great, great for plowing snow its really fast for that.
When you dont know anything of a topic you should stay quiet. Unless you got 8 tuborgs in ya!!!
Those machines of theirs are as good as any and are used all over the world.
I have written, wha it is about. Its a political boycut and has nothing to do with ever they are the best in the world or close to.
When they in 1916 sell for 8 BILLION dollars, they cant be bad. We use many of them among others and have have no more complaints about them,then for anyone else. We have many small vessels with engine.
I also live in a town with as shipyard having a closed dry dock being 81 meters and 2 lines for takung smallewr ships up for repair and paint.
Often the harbour is full of vessels. And we have at least 6 ferries in and out every day and some weekly cargos.
https://www.portofhirtshals.com/
To that we a food industri and also sell many trawls up to 10 hektars.
Stop drinking the kool-aid. If you think that the Russian military is reliant on western manufacturers then it is YOU who has a touch of the retardation. Sure, they buy some foreign items for a multitude of reasons, but its a small minority, mostly niche items, and nothing they cannot make themselves if they choose to.
Embargoing Russia simply encourages them to develop their own, and then export their equivalent at a cheaper price. Sweden looses sales, and faces stiffer competition in the future.
Well, Chinese produce parts for Volvo, Sweden is at the best assembling them, but probably they are only selling and packing (you know, those rocket scientists from Eritrea sucks).
So China can sell unbranded Volvo copies to Russia directly without Swedish participation for fraction of the price BUT Russian are obsessed with fair play and don’t buy unlicenced copies. Guess why ? Because they want to sell their completed boats to foreign customers. And why they don’t produce their own engines ? Well, because built factory for some 50 engines per year is not very economical, when Chinese make ten thousands of them. That’s why.
It’s not that Russia can’t make them, it is free market enterprise which made it unprofitable to produce those engines in Russia after the fall of the Soviet Union. No one wanted a new powerboat with a Russian engine after Yeltsin took over, it was all the best Western gear, to go with the London mansions. Now Russia will rebuild those industries, providing even more competition for Volvo, MTU and Japanese concerns.
Stupid move by Sweden. Russia will use Chinese motors. Depending on their current or future needs, Russia will likely build their own. They’re marine diesels. Not exactly rocket science. The West seems to think they can poke the bear without consequence. Sweden and Germany in the case of this commodity have taken themselves out the running. Do they honestly think they can recover this market some time in the future? This market is gone forever.
“They’re marine diesels. Not exactly rocket science.”
Bearings Castings Forging Alloys Thermodynamics Lubricants Actuators Piezoelectrics Sensors Semi-conductors Software Chemical and material sealants Etc. Etc
BUT!!! No rockets…..
Japan has the best marine motors.
Its not rocket science so it should be possible to make Russia´s own rather than depend on Chinese.
If Russia can make engines for the rockets, subs and hypersonic weapons, I cant see a problem other than Sweden is yet one more country to pay the heavy price for US lunacy.
Both Japan and South Korea foreign policy is influenced by Washington. So, Russia have two choices, buy Chinese for the moment while developing their own.
..or marinise an existing engine in the correct power/weight range.
It is clear that the anti-West needs a manufacturer of high-quality engines for transportation, power generation and marine use. Chinese seem to produce mostly junk so there is a potentially massive market to tap into.
I think thats very unfair to the Chinese. Their navy seems to have good availability with no signs of ships breaking down with any regularity, certainly no more than US/HATO.
Russian navy has had issues with Chinese diesel supplied for tyhe Buyan-M class riverboats/light corvettes, but that was apparently due to mis-operation and incorrect lubricants.
Generally speaking, the Chinese don’t make junk. You can’t judge their high-end manufacturing based on crappy consumer rubbish where the customer (Western importers) are the ones who set the price and drive it to the floor. Somethings gotta give, and you only get what you pay for…
I suppose Chinese can produce everything. You can buy for $2000 some stern diesel based on 2l Daimler-Benz OM601 from 1980 reduced to 40 HP and you can buy unbranded unlicenced copy of state of the art diesel Volvo-Penta stern engine for speed boats made on the same machines and from the same materials as original with 200 HP from 2,5 l. It is all about your ability to order what you really need and pay for it.
russia never was able to make good engines in cars, boats, ships.
Clearly there is opportunity for improvement as well as market opportunity.
Thats a lie. What about rocket engines? Rd-180 ring a bell you uneducated uncultured swine?
Even the t34 engine was good, just not the tranny.
Not sure there is such thing as a good tranny… deep voices, big hands, Adams apple, tacky make-up…
which rocket engine is used in cars??? you are conrete in your head :DDD
t34??? :DDD you isiot, marshal malinovkij removed in 1942 all t-34s beacuse of their shitty engines. inly the last 2 version in end of 44 and in 45 were acceptable t-34s.
Kamaz is very good truck. And Lada Niva is also good. T72 also drives in Syria trough all kind of terrains.
Kamaz always winn Dakar rally.
lada niva is shit. also now, when 52% is french. t72 was a big mistake. i sat in that coffin. kamaz has giant need for fuel, and very often went wrong.
Two birds with one stone by Zioamerica. Kill off every one’s industry but its own and try unsuccessfully to hurt Russia. Wont work!
Stickerman Tudor Miron and jesus will solve this problem.
Rocket science mentioned a lot in these comments but nothing about the US using Russian rockets to send up their precious satellites. It’s odd how Russia is sanctioned for an endless list of unverified indiscretions while the US sails along with a long list of known criminality. I cannot see this continuing, at some point it will reverse and it will be ugly.
The key seems to be in the petro-dollar reserve currency status. You see pragmatic business decisions being made out of fear, not respect or loyalty, fear. Business will move to eliminate this dynamic. Slowly but surely the lever will be shortened and then removed all together. Every day without WW III brings this reckoning time closer. Dependence on the current international banking system has brought much grief to average people and inappropriate wealth to criminals, this will end.
Stupid swedes, nothing but zio lapdogs anymore
You certainly is off.
You certainly is off
So, that is the Sweds problem, because there is one thing I know and a lot of people with me knows about Volvo engines as this Penta, thats they are simply cheep crapp, an genuine shit machine, week diesel engine witch you simply cant trust, Russians, Volvo penta is rubbish, even I dont want any boat , now or into the future, with any kind of Volvo marined engine what so ever, there are other engines that I know is way much better (yeah, even the wankees can do it better) , and the fact that you cant do it makes me wounder, becase Penta is crapp. Make your own. And in the Rivers and shallow Russian lakes, I would go for water jets, they can run on dough and there little or nothing else that beats the manuverability of an water jet, smal jet engines. thats why you need seat belts on this ships, they can stop on 1 or 2 boat lenght and thats equall to crashing an car into an wall, they are insanly manuverable. And I love them.
peace
Its not even about those machines but boycut politics.
You not even have a oppinion about these motors as well as the rest of them.
Last Year they sold for 8 billion dollars and the russian military use it – So the russians are stupid in reliable machines ?
And then You even add jet skies. I am sure Russians are fine in techn about jet, katamaran.
But You seemes to have forgotten those use strong and reliable engines as well. You did not know pedals, sail, nucleares, coal….
Coal is good. You also can use it for writing.
Sweden is becoming zionist country. All the press is controled by Jewish family.
You must be joking, they systematicly has imported muslims in the many 100.000 level.
If the Nobel Foundation made a price for bad excuses doing nothing Yourself, most winners the next many years were from ME.
Your comment shows You not even know anything about Sweden a well.
Sorry but YOU must be joking. You dont know that globalist jews are behing the muslin inmigration not only in Sweden but in all Europe.?? That Mr george Soros finance the muslim and african invasion to Europe.?? Do you know how is Barbara Lerner Spectre and American Sweden jewish that push for multiculturalims ( invasion of Muslins and African ) In Sweden. Do you know Kalergi plan to mix races in europe?? Count Kalergi a Rothschild agent and the idea was to destroy white race with inmigration. Was the first to receive the Carlomagne price ( to european traitors).You are an ignorant.
If its like that and we are weak like You, we deserve it – hahah.
Take a Rotchild cigar and a glass of wine for that.
You are Ignorant and cretin.
The ususal dirty comment from most of You. Just dirt.
Very strange russinas dont produce those motors themselves as well as Penta sell even one ti the whole world.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volvo_Penta
Yeah, use some chinese shit, that sounds smart…